Hunting Preserve Market?

[Reed68]

You guys that have hunt area's, How is this years market looking?
I would like some feedback on if hunts are booked, or booked and getting cancelled.

Just mainly an overall outlook on how this years shooter buck market is looking. And what type of deer are costomers asking for. I know there are lots of guys on these forums that have hunt area's so dont be shy.

[Liveoak]

We're doing good enough on our Fenced hunts we'll have to buy some shooters this year. On the free range side of things a little off, about 70% booked. We're not getting as many calls from "lookers" as usual but we'll be alright. I spoke the other day to an outfitter up the road and he's barely 20%. I think most people are hanging on to their hunting money til August or so, but maybe thats wishful thinking.

Talked to a friend in Alabama the other day that said he's never seen so many hunting clubs there looking for members. There's going to be some stockers in auction here in Texas in late July and it'll be interesting to see if they sell above the reserve. It'll be interesting to see if they'll sell em or hang on to them for another year.

[Reed68]

Thanks Liveoak, Thats the kind of info I was looking for. Any other of you nothern guys have any info.

I just speaking up for alot of small farmers, who would like like to know some (estimated) futures, this fall.

[Whitetail Sanctuary]

thanks reed i too am one of those small guy's who's interested great ? hope they give us some info

[foodplot]

It always seems to pick up in July.I have alot of guys interested in comming this year.Usually don't get deposits until July and Aug.

[Reed68]

Still not alot of feed back. You guys with small farms better pay attention to the market, or all those pics, and video's of those monsters will be worth nothing.

[CameronCrow]

What about the market for coorperate leases?

[Reed68]

I'm worried about the hunting market in general.

[ddwhitetails]

Yep we need to pay attention to the Market alright However, it is out of our control....all we can do is watch and adjust to how ever the market goes. But you are right Reed we need to be aware of what the market is going to do.....the cost of feeding deer sure hasn't gone down....

[PaintedMeadowsBJs]

Just like the stock market if everyone sells the price will bottom out...
If people give deer away no one will be willing to pay...
I think whitetail exchange is a great thing... but people also have to realize some deals slip through on there... but it doesn't make it (the stock or semen) worth less ....then want the price that cheap all the time.

[Liveoak]

Thoughts on a couple things about the market... The corporate market is diminishing right now I believe. I know of several landowners around that had their ranches leased to companies last year that are looking for someone to lease their place this fall. The problem with this trend is these landowners have been spoiled. Now understand these are "free range" landowners, some Ive leased from in the past, that were getting twice what I pay and in my opinion were getting overharvested by these companies. Now these landowners think that price is the going rate and expect that but I'm not going to pay it and I dont believe many other "individuals" or outfitters will either.

This may end up having a good effect on the preserve and outfitting markets and hopefuly it will settle the price of leases for a while. I know leases in this area have been steadily going up since 1995, it cant last forever. The adverse effect may be the landowners trying to go up on prices to make up for losses in other areas, again it depends on what hunters are willing to pay. Personally I'm not raising the price on anything and dont plan on paying any more for any lease. I recently had a landowner try to raise the price mid lease and basicly I told them I cant pay that and I'll have my stands and feeders off by the end of the month. They changed their mind but needless to say I dont have any respect for said landowner anymore and once the lease is up that will be it.

I think the deer market is in a similar place. Take away or lower the numbers of hunters, which is the driving force of this market and prices will fall. Its not going to fall because preserves charge less its going to fall because they dont need as many deer to supply their lower number of hunters. Then the next stage affecting the price will be how many breeders are willing to hold onto shooters another year, or even two? What do you do then? I personally would pay a little more for a 170 3 yr old then I will a 170 5yr old just because of survivability alone. By the time you hold that deer two years and get the same amount of money for him you havent made anything, even if he ends up being 200 at 5(if he even lives til then). You also have to deal with pen space as another possible problem.
The bigger problem will be the year after though. If the hunting market trends down for just one year and say 3 out of 10 breeders opt out of selling shooters for less money that year thats a 30% increase in the number of shooters for the following year. Unless the hunting market picks up 30% that year you're going to be screwed again.......

I dont agree that the price will bottom out or people wont be willing to pay if people sell for less than what theyve been getting. The preserves have to adapt to the hunting market to survive and the breeders will have to adapt to the preserve market to survive as well. In my opinion those that do adapt will be around. Its happening all around us right now, If you dont adapt or have something everyone wants you may not be here in 5 years unless you have really deep pockets. Somehow I dont think we'll be bailed out if our markets fall..... The absolute worst part of the shooter buck market is there's such a small window to make all these decisions and hope you get it right.

[Reed68]

Very Good, Live Oak.

Bottem line is "hunt area's keep my hobbie alive". Without a good market, I loose a great part of me and my families life. Hell, I cant take my girls camping because we have a little bottle fed that needs "alittle more attention". It's what we love to do. Hunt area's, if there is anything as a breeder that I can do to help, let me know.

[Ferguson288]

I got up to 30 shooter bucks to get rid of....our market is kind of slow but we need to get rid of them all this year....we are startin over after new management took over and are having a little trouble trying to sell the shooters off, but its startin to get movin

[Ferguson288]

I mean by 30 shooters is that we have 30 shooters in our preserve right now that need to be harvested this fall and winter

[Droptine]

This is the worst economy any of us have ever lived through, of course that's going to have some impact on the deer market. Some people will have to take a year off from paid hunts and some will look for a cheaper lease. The good news is Obama is sending us a bail out check, so you don't have anything to worry about :p

[foodplot]

He is killing us.

[Reed68]

I guess if we needed support from Obama, we could start raising trophy flies.

[Barr'sWCT]

I am just a new farm I guess only in business for 3 years. First year no buck born, second year only 4 born which are a year old this year. This year 10 buck born out of 14 fawns born on my farm this year. So I guess it was a good year for me with buck fawns. But if the market don't go up in the next 2 yrs. I will be feeding them plus what ever else is born on the farm until then. Good luck to everyone that is selling their shooters this year.

[Hindsite]

Bookings are down from last year as consumer confidence is dwindling. Thank god for repeats that make up most of our hunts this fall.

This will be a critical year for some preserves as we all need to generate feed money at the very least. This may not be a year for showing much of a profit although I remain optimistic that as the season starts the inquiry's will increase.........My fingers are crossed!

[Hardpan]

Hey Steve,
Where are you at? I am between Menard and Eldorado. Anyway, I took the last year off of selling hunts for a few reasons. First is that the economy is bad and getting worse. Lot's of my hunters are out of work... So, I decided to hold off a year rather than have a losing money operation. In fairness, I also bought a larger ranch, and I am not happy with my deer quality either. So, waiting a year is ok.

On the downside, I was hoping to use this as a strong supplement to my other income. Not happening in this economy.

Best,
Hardpan (Michael)

[Reed68]

I want to re-open this thread to ask if the market still sucks. I have four bucks in Oklahoma, that it looks like I will be giving away this year.

I also hear of alot of farms selling out this year. That may be a good thing of those that wont make it through the hard times wont be producing anymore bucks for next year.

The way its going now, I makes you sit down a take a LONG look at the future.

Please tell me I am wrong, I will reach 5 years CWD in March.Is that really gonna matter?

[Rick]

we need to start focusing on some positives starting to happen in our economy, if you talk with freight companies it sounds like there is more freight starting to move across the country, I am hearing of some job openings with some good companies, other companies are starting to see an increase in sales, some employess are starting to get their 40hrs compared to the 32 they have been worki ng for the last yr. Things run in cycles, the ones that make it through usually reap the bigger rewards
If this trend continues our deer market will start moving in a more positive direction as well... if it does not continue or gets worse the best thing we have to look forward to is the Rapture.......

[alpha and omega whitetail]

Amen Rick. Things seem to be turning around some but it will take some time before it is back but I believe it will turn enough to level oout for now, at least I pray it does.

[IndependenceRanch]

Rick, you are correct. I do see a change for the better coming. If you all recall I spoke about how my company (an air freight company) might have been getting ready to recall pilots. Well they did, AND they even bought another used Boeing 747-400. Trust me if these guys are doing this, the turn is coming soon, because the move was not just because of the military flights.
FYI, I did not go back to work yet though. The next recall I will most likely go back.

[Reed68]

I hope you guys are right.

[Deerchaser]

I believe the turn in the economy has already happened but the growth will be so slow you will not feel it. One day you will just look around and feel things are not so bad.

[IndependenceRanch]

I believe the turn in the economy has already happened but the growth will be so slow you will not feel it. One day you will just look around and feel things are not so bad.

I agree with that statement.

[Jack]

I’m out of the loop out here in Montana so can only relate how the elk industry went as my guide in what is happening to the deer industry.

We had a shortage of elk in the 70’s to the mid 90’s so elk prices were very strong. After the mid 90’s we were over supplied with elk. I like many blamed the problem on everything but the correct problem which was we had too many elk for harvest and not enough hunters and not enough harvest facilities. Harvest facilities lowered their harvest prices to connect with a new client base rather than spend money to keep reasonable prices for harvests. I think we are at that stage now in the deer business. I hope we don’t make the same choice as the elk industry.

Every business is run by supply and demand. Our deer supply now exceeds our hunters and the only thing that will change that is better public relations about the deer high fence harvest part of our industry if we are to maintain our current prices. We must support our harvest facilities because without them we will have no business.

We as an industry have done very little to change public opinion on our harvest facilities. We had better figure out how to get more people using the high fence hunting facilities as this is the only way we will have any demand for our shooter deer. If we can’t get more hunters on the hunting facilities the demand for our high fence deer will go away just like elk did.

My advice on this is for every five deer the harvest facility buys from us we give one deer to support TV advertizing on high fence hunting. I ran this type of ad when we were in the harvest business and it was very well received by the public. Just my opinion here boys and girls I’m not looking for a fight.